more on et al. handling

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more on et al. handling

Bruce D'Arcus-3
OK, here's what I've come up with as the simplest general solution:

     <citation>
       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
        <rule when-more-than="6" and-position="first" use-first="1"/>
        <rule when-more-than="2" and-less-than="6" and-position="subsequent"
use-first="1"/>
       </multi-name-replace>
        ....
     </citation>
     <bibliography author-as-sort-order="all" author-shorten="yes">
       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
        <rule when-more-than="6" use-first="6"/>
       </multi-name-replace>
       ...

That implements the APA algorithm.

A more simple example -- say for Chicago -- would just be:

     <citation>
       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
        <rule when-more-than="3" use-first="1"/>
       </multi-name-replace>
        ....
     </citation>
     <bibliography author-as-sort-order="all" author-shorten="yes">
       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
        <rule when-more-than="3" use-first="1"/>
       </multi-name-replace>
       ...

For reference, current et al. handling is a single attribute, like this:

    <names initialize-with=". " shorten-after="3" and-as=" &amp;"/>

... where the actual rendering (et al.) is hard-coded in the XSLT.

The only thing I don't like about this new approach -- aside from it
being more verbose than needed in most cases -- is that the content is
in an attribute.

What do people think? Could this be implemented reasonably in a GUI?

Bruce



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Re: more on et al. handling

James Howison
How would that work with biblio styles that require 'et al' to be in
italics?

On May 22, 2005, at 6:00 PM, Bruce D'Arcus wrote:

> OK, here's what I've come up with as the simplest general solution:
>
>     <citation>
>       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
> <rule when-more-than="6" and-position="first" use-first="1"/>
> <rule when-more-than="2" and-less-than="6" and-position="subsequent"
> use-first="1"/>
>       </multi-name-replace>
>        ....
>     </citation>
>     <bibliography author-as-sort-order="all" author-shorten="yes">
>       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
> <rule when-more-than="6" use-first="6"/>
>       </multi-name-replace>
>       ...
>
> That implements the APA algorithm.
>
> A more simple example -- say for Chicago -- would just be:
>
>     <citation>
>       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
> <rule when-more-than="3" use-first="1"/>
>       </multi-name-replace>
>        ....
>     </citation>
>     <bibliography author-as-sort-order="all" author-shorten="yes">
>       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
> <rule when-more-than="3" use-first="1"/>
>       </multi-name-replace>
>       ...
>
> For reference, current et al. handling is a single attribute, like
> this:
>
>    <names initialize-with=". " shorten-after="3" and-as=" &amp;"/>
>
> ... where the actual rendering (et al.) is hard-coded in the XSLT.
>
> The only thing I don't like about this new approach -- aside from it
> being more verbose than needed in most cases -- is that the content is
> in an attribute.
>
> What do people think? Could this be implemented reasonably in a GUI?
>
> Bruce
>
>
>
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>
--James
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Re: more on et al. handling

Bruce D'Arcus-3
On May 22, 2005, at 6:22 PM, James Howison wrote:

> How would that work with biblio styles that require 'et al' to be in
> italics?

Two options:

1) add more attributes for styling

2) add a "render" element with those attributes

It's always safer to go with elements, even if they feel more verbose
(and are).

Bruce



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Re: more on et al. handling

Bruce D'Arcus-3
In reply to this post by James Howison
On May 22, 2005, at 6:22 PM, James Howison wrote:

> How would that work with biblio styles that require 'et al' to be in
> italics?

Followup.

I think I figured out how to simplify this a lot.  Instead of doing
this:

       <multi-name-replace replace-with="et al.">
        <rule when-more-than="6" and-position="first" use-first="1"/>
        <rule when-more-than="2" and-less-than="6" and-position="subsequent"
use-first="1"/>
       </multi-name-replace>

... which is somewhat inconsistent, verbose, and difficult to process,
I instead say that styles such as this (APA) distinguish first from
subsequent citation rendering, and so should be configured in ways
consistent with that styling in the note classes.

     <citation>
       <prefix>(</prefix>
       <first>
        <ibid min-authors="6" use-first="1" font-style="italic">ibid.</ibid>
        <entry delimiter=";">
          <creator>
            <names-short/>
            <suffix> </suffix>
          </creator>
          <year/>
          <point>
            <prefix>: </prefix>
          </point>
        </entry>
       </first>
       <subsequent>
        <ibid min-authors="3" use-first="1" font-style="italic">ibid.</ibid>
        <entry delimiter=";">
          <creator>
            <names-short/>
            <suffix> </suffix>
          </creator>
          <year/>
          <point>
            <prefix>: </prefix>
          </point>
        </entry>
       </subsequent>
       <suffix>)</suffix>
     </citation>

The only thing that kind of sucks with this is it's more verbose.

A hybrid alternative would be:

     <citation>
       <prefix>(</prefix>
       <ibid font-style="italic">
          <first min-authors="6" use-first="1"
font-style="italic">ibid.</first>
           <subsequent min-authors="3" use-first="1">ibid.</subsequent>
       <entry delimiter=";">
        <creator>
          <names-short/>
          <suffix> </suffix>
        </creator>
        <year/>
        <point>
          <prefix>: </prefix>
        </point>
       </entry>
       <suffix>)</suffix>
     </citation>

Opinions?

Again, these decisions should be made based on a number of factors,
including how amenable they are to GUIs.

Bruce



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Re: more on et al. handling

Bruce D'Arcus-3
In reply to this post by James Howison
Um, am tired; substitute "ibid" in the markup example with "et-al"!

Bruce



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Re: more on et al. handling

Bruce D'Arcus-3
In reply to this post by James Howison
So here's the corrected alternative:

     <citation>
       <et-al>
        <first min-authors="6" use-first="1"/>
        <subsequent min-authors="3" use-first="1"/>
        <renderas font-style="italic">et al.</renderas>
       </et-al>
       <prefix>(</prefix>
       <entry delimiter=";">
        <creator>
          <names-short/>
          <suffix> </suffix>
        </creator>
        <year/>
        <point>
          <prefix>: </prefix>
        </point>
       </entry>
       <suffix>)</suffix>
     </citation>

For the bibliography in APA, you'd get:

     <bibliography author-as-sort-order="all" author-shorten="yes">
       <et-al>
        <all min-authors="6" use-first="6"/>
        <renderas font-style="italic">et al.</renderas>
       </et-al>

Note: am not sure APA asks for italicized "et al." phrases, but just
responding to James' question about that.

Bruce