questions on dbng-html.xsl

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questions on dbng-html.xsl

James Howison
I'm working with the citeproc files downloaded from:

http://www.users.muohio.edu/darcusb/files/citeproc.tar.gz

which was linked to in:

http://netapps.muohio.edu/blogs/darcusb/darcusb/archives/2005/02/10/ 
bleeding-edge-workflow

I've gotten it all working now with eXist and oXygen (damn the capital  
X's!).  BTW, the blog entry says to use an eXist database called 'mods'  
but the xsl actually looks for one called 'biblio', once that is fixed  
things basically work ;)

So these might be out of date, if so forgive me and let me know where i  
should get the up-to-date ones.

I had docbook structure like:

<sect1>
    <sect2>
    </sect2>
</sect1>

which the transforms didn't like, I changed that to

<section>
   <section>
   </section>
</section>

and that worked much better?

I prefer the <section> stuff but my reading of the docbook ng docs  
seemed to suggest <sect1>?

Also is there a way to have the xml transforms create the required css  
files? At the moment I'm copying in one that Bruce sent me.

Thoughts?

--James
US Cell: +1 315 395 4056
Full Contact Details on VCard:
http://freelancepropaganda.com/jameshowison.vcf



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Re: questions on dbng-html.xsl

M. David Peterson-2
Lets try this again with a "reply-all" this time...

Copy of my response (Thanks for the catch James!)

Hi James,

You can access the Subversion repository for the project at
http://citeproc-source.x2x2x.org/svn/citeproc

You can also browse the source bys simply accessing this same URL from
a web browser.  Bruce is in LA at the moment and last I heard would be
trying to check email off and on throughout the day and evening so I
will assume that he will respond with additional comments as
necessary.  I personally am in a transitional stage delivering the
Saxon.NET project in a 1.0 release and then handing that off to
another set of developers for support which means I will be personally
involved with this project from a development standpoint in
significant amounts over the coming days but there's still a learning
curve involved for me at the moment, especially as I transition my
mind from writing the code for the XSLT processor to the actual XSLT
itself... but in reality my focus is to stomp bugs and help Bruce
deliver the  little remain pieces that he hasnt already developed...
Quite amazing to go from a non-developer to an XSLT-uber-geek in a
couple of months if you ask me ;)

I mention all of this as I want to make sure that as the known bugs
are stomped and the community begins to use and subsequently test
things further that Bruce can focus on the areas that he feels need
the most attention knowing that the back-end tools that have been put
into place will allow for a comfortable interface such that you don't
have to be a developer to even understand how to submit and check on a
bug nor do you have to feel like the developers working on these bugs
are completely inaccessible or if they are accessible so hopped up on
caffeine that available must now be considered on a  case-per-case
basis, personal safety the concern more than the bug being submitted.
:D

If you see things that you feel will help make this process easier
please submit to this list and as long as Bruce doesn't running in
throwing red flags I will do my best to add this information into my
planned daily community interface upkeep.  Its becoming more obvious
each day that the line between hacker and user is blurring as projects
such as this begin to provide a programming syntax to an ever growing
population of users who are making statements such as "thats all he
does and gets paid how much?... Give me that manual!"  Obviously this
will begin to open up the interface in ways never before seen as the
users are now at the point that the tools exists that they can very
easily make adjustments without cause of concern a help desk call is
imminent.  If you have suggestions I have no doubt Bruce will be
intersted to hear them and if unavalable I will fill in and snsure the
proper iinfo past...


On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:38:11 -0500, James Howison <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'm working with the citeproc files downloaded from:
>
> http://www.users.muohio.edu/darcusb/files/citeproc.tar.gz
>
> which was linked to in:
>
> http://netapps.muohio.edu/blogs/darcusb/darcusb/archives/2005/02/10/
> bleeding-edge-workflow
>
> I've gotten it all working now with eXist and oXygen (damn the capital
> X's!).  BTW, the blog entry says to use an eXist database called 'mods'
> but the xsl actually looks for one called 'biblio', once that is fixed
> things basically work ;)
>
> So these might be out of date, if so forgive me and let me know where i
> should get the up-to-date ones.
>
> I had docbook structure like:
>
> <sect1>
>     <sect2>
>     </sect2>
> </sect1>
>
> which the transforms didn't like, I changed that to
>
> <section>
>    <section>
>    </section>
> </section>
>
> and that worked much better?
>
> I prefer the <section> stuff but my reading of the docbook ng docs
> seemed to suggest <sect1>?
>
> Also is there a way to have the xml transforms create the required css
> files? At the moment I'm copying in one that Bruce sent me.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> --James
> US Cell: +1 315 395 4056
> Full Contact Details on VCard:
> http://freelancepropaganda.com/jameshowison.vcf
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide
> Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users.
> Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now.
> http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=6595&alloc_id=14396&op=click
> _______________________________________________
> xbiblio-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/xbiblio-devel
>


--
<M:D/>

:: M. David Peterson ::
XML & XML Transformations, C#, .NET, and Functional Languages Specialist


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Re: questions on dbng-html.xsl

M. David Peterson-2
James, I will copy and paste your responses since this was my goof
up...  I will do that now and respond appropriately


On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:55:43 -0700, M. David Peterson
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Lets try this again with a "reply-all" this time...
>
> Copy of my response (Thanks for the catch James!)
>
> Hi James,
>
> You can access the Subversion repository for the project at
> http://citeproc-source.x2x2x.org/svn/citeproc
>
> You can also browse the source bys simply accessing this same URL from
> a web browser.  Bruce is in LA at the moment and last I heard would be
> trying to check email off and on throughout the day and evening so I
> will assume that he will respond with additional comments as
> necessary.  I personally am in a transitional stage delivering the
> Saxon.NET project in a 1.0 release and then handing that off to
> another set of developers for support which means I will be personally
> involved with this project from a development standpoint in
> significant amounts over the coming days but there's still a learning
> curve involved for me at the moment, especially as I transition my
> mind from writing the code for the XSLT processor to the actual XSLT
> itself... but in reality my focus is to stomp bugs and help Bruce
> deliver the  little remain pieces that he hasnt already developed...
> Quite amazing to go from a non-developer to an XSLT-uber-geek in a
> couple of months if you ask me ;)
>
> I mention all of this as I want to make sure that as the known bugs
> are stomped and the community begins to use and subsequently test
> things further that Bruce can focus on the areas that he feels need
> the most attention knowing that the back-end tools that have been put
> into place will allow for a comfortable interface such that you don't
> have to be a developer to even understand how to submit and check on a
> bug nor do you have to feel like the developers working on these bugs
> are completely inaccessible or if they are accessible so hopped up on
> caffeine that available must now be considered on a  case-per-case
> basis, personal safety the concern more than the bug being submitted.
> :D
>
> If you see things that you feel will help make this process easier
> please submit to this list and as long as Bruce doesn't running in
> throwing red flags I will do my best to add this information into my
> planned daily community interface upkeep.  Its becoming more obvious
> each day that the line between hacker and user is blurring as projects
> such as this begin to provide a programming syntax to an ever growing
> population of users who are making statements such as "thats all he
> does and gets paid how much?... Give me that manual!"  Obviously this
> will begin to open up the interface in ways never before seen as the
> users are now at the point that the tools exists that they can very
> easily make adjustments without cause of concern a help desk call is
> imminent.  If you have suggestions I have no doubt Bruce will be
> intersted to hear them and if unavalable I will fill in and snsure the
> proper iinfo past...
>
> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:38:11 -0500, James Howison <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > I'm working with the citeproc files downloaded from:
> >
> > http://www.users.muohio.edu/darcusb/files/citeproc.tar.gz
> >
> > which was linked to in:
> >
> > http://netapps.muohio.edu/blogs/darcusb/darcusb/archives/2005/02/10/
> > bleeding-edge-workflow
> >
> > I've gotten it all working now with eXist and oXygen (damn the capital
> > X's!).  BTW, the blog entry says to use an eXist database called 'mods'
> > but the xsl actually looks for one called 'biblio', once that is fixed
> > things basically work ;)
> >
> > So these might be out of date, if so forgive me and let me know where i
> > should get the up-to-date ones.
> >
> > I had docbook structure like:
> >
> > <sect1>
> >     <sect2>
> >     </sect2>
> > </sect1>
> >
> > which the transforms didn't like, I changed that to
> >
> > <section>
> >    <section>
> >    </section>
> > </section>
> >
> > and that worked much better?
> >
> > I prefer the <section> stuff but my reading of the docbook ng docs
> > seemed to suggest <sect1>?
> >
> > Also is there a way to have the xml transforms create the required css
> > files? At the moment I'm copying in one that Bruce sent me.
> >
> > Thoughts?
> >
> > --James
> > US Cell: +1 315 395 4056
> > Full Contact Details on VCard:
> > http://freelancepropaganda.com/jameshowison.vcf
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide
> > Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users.
> > Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now.
> > http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=6595&alloc_id=14396&op=click
> > _______________________________________________
> > xbiblio-devel mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/xbiblio-devel
> >
>
> --
> <M:D/>
>
> :: M. David Peterson ::
> XML & XML Transformations, C#, .NET, and Functional Languages Specialist
>


--
<M:D/>

:: M. David Peterson ::
XML & XML Transformations, C#, .NET, and Functional Languages Specialist


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Re: questions on dbng-html.xsl

James Howison
In reply to this post by M. David Peterson-2
And my response to your response, without the CC to you this time.

May I give a hearty +1 for changing the list defaults to "reply to
list".  The argument rages but for a discussion and inclusion list I
think it is the right thing to do ;)

On Mar 16, 2005, at 11:31 PM, M. David Peterson wrote:

> Hi James,
>
> You can access the Subversion repository for the project at
> http://citeproc-source.x2x2x.org/svn/citeproc

ok, that is different from the one that I had forgotten having trouble
connecting to:

svn co https://www.ceridwen.com/svn/xbiblio/trunk/citeproc citeproc

I did get the https working, but it was so long ago I'd forgotten all
about it :)

Ok, I'm sure that you guys will work out the canonical location soon.  
The one you sent worked fine for me.  Not sure about the branching et
al.  I'll hold off taking a look for the moment.

> You can also browse the source bys simply accessing this same URL from
> a web browser.  Bruce is in LA at the moment and last I heard would be
> trying to check email off and on throughout the day and evening so I
> will assume that he will respond with additional comments as
> necessary.  I personally am in a transitional stage delivering the
> Saxon.NET project in a 1.0 release and then handing that off to
> another set of developers for support which means I will be personally
> involved with this project from a development standpoint in
> significant amounts over the coming days but there's still a learning
> curve involved for me at the moment, especially as I transition my
> mind from writing the code for the XSLT processor to the actual XSLT
> itself... but in reality my focus is to stomp bugs and help Bruce
> deliver the  little remain pieces that he hasnt already developed...
> Quite amazing to go from a non-developer to an XSLT-uber-geek in a
> couple of months if you ask me ;)

Yeah, it is quite an achievement.  And I've proven to myself tonight
that citeproc both works and that XLST is something I want to get
better at, so I'm happy about that.

> I mention all of this as I want to make sure that as the known bugs
> are stomped and the community begins to use and subsequently test
> things further that Bruce can focus on the areas that he feels need
> the most attention knowing that the back-end tools that have been put
> into place will allow for a comfortable interface such that you don't
> have to be a developer to even understand how to submit and check on a
> bug nor do you have to feel like the developers working on these bugs
> are completely inaccessible or if they are accessible so hopped up on
> caffeine that available must now be considered on a  case-per-case
> basis, personal safety the concern more than the bug being submitted.
> :D

Yeah, did I see right that you are considering the Trac system?

It seems to me that building a great set of test cases and a regression
testing system is vital to a system like this, do you agree?  Do you
have any ideas on how we can get something like that going?

Cheers,
James



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Re: questions on dbng-html.xsl

M. David Peterson-2
On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 00:01:34 -0500, James Howison <[hidden email]> wrote:
> And my response to your response, without the CC to you this time.
>
> May I give a hearty +1 for changing the list defaults to "reply to
> list".  The argument rages but for a discussion and inclusion list I
> think it is the right thing to do ;)
>
> On Mar 16, 2005, at 11:31 PM, M. David Peterson wrote:
>

> Hi James,
>
> You can access the Subversion repository for the project at
> http://citeproc-source.x2x2x.org/svn/citeproc

ok, that is different from the one that I had forgotten having trouble
connecting to:

svn co https://www.ceridwen.com/svn/xbiblio/trunk/citeproc citeproc

I did get the https working, but it was so long ago I'd forgotten all
about it :)

Ok, I'm sure that you guys will work out the canonical location soon.
The one you sent worked fine for me.  Not sure about the branching et
al.

> but in reality my focus is to stomp bugs and help Bruce
> deliver the  little remain pieces that he hasnt already developed...
> Quite amazing to go from a non-developer to an XSLT-uber-geek in a
> couple of months if you ask me ;)

 Yeah, it is quite an achievement.  And I've proven to myself tonight
 that citeproc both works and that XLST is something I want to get
 better at, so I'm happy about that.

^^^ NICE!!!! ^^^  Bruce, you have another convert :D

> completely inaccessible or if they are accessible so hopped up on
> caffeine that available must now be considered on a  case-per-case
> basis, personal safety the concern more than the bug being submitted.
> :D

> Yeah, did I see right that you are considering the Trac system?

Yeah, we considered it and decided that it just wasnt going to work
for this project...  We really needed something less, browser per-se
and more commandline-ish so Bruce decided on... Ok, I cant go anywhere
further with this one...

http://citeproc.x2x2x.org/cgi-bin/trac.cgi

Bruce even found the time to doll it all up with tickets and
milestones and all sorts of fun stuff.  So I'd say that between
becoming an XSLT hacker over the holiday season and properly managing
this piece of the project hes got a lot accomplished in  some pretty
amazing time periods [NOTE: you must always remember than "managing"
me means finding ways to avoid getting the next flight out to SLC,
stopping by the hardware store on the way to my apartment and using
the newly purchased lock and chains to smash the window as an element
of surprisewhich would be long enough to keep me stunned while you
subsequently lock me down and sturnly state "CODE. NOW!"  I'm guessing
this is only one of several tactics Bruce considered but in reality it
was the learning curve of Linux AND Trac that kept me swearing that if
I ever found the man that was responsible for this sick joke that I
was the butt of he might find plenty of time to make the install
process something less of a complete rewrite of all that is plain and
logical as he nurses his two broken legs back to health... luckily
something magic happened and when I typed some gibberish into the
command-line and it worked whomever this was was finding the voodoo
hex I pay $6000 for suddently and mysterious "MIA" (the $6000 grand
covered a "watch him and if he tries to run, tackle him and gag him
and call me to let me know" added bonus curse to use at anytime... its
too bad I dont believe in curses,  huh!? :D

It seems to me that building a great set of test cases and a regression
testing system is vital to a system like this, do you agree?  Do you
have any ideas on how we can get something like that going?

I do have ideas but want to deliver these few little bugs that are
standing in the way of a release such that Bruce can stop paying for
the monthly Oxygen tank rental.  From a good and bad stand point last
weekends efforts resulted in finding what seem to have been the last
and final showstoppers for Saxon.NET and as such as I already
mentioned I wil be delivering this to the rest of the crew to take on
from here... I do have Saxon# which is my new solo project but with a
completed Saxon.NET in 1.0 release format the pressure is off me from
that angle and I can slowly and correctly begin to desing the
architecture for Saxon# while I put citeproc on my full time status
listing for the next 3-4 weeks until it is at a point that is felt to
be the "right" place to call a v1 release that is ready to handle all
that is thrown at it and more from both a code standpoint. support
standpoint, and expand into new ideas and pinpoint the next focus
areas...

What processor are you using to run the transform at the moment? Saxon
or Saxon.NET?


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Re: questions on dbng-html.xsl

Bruce D'Arcus
First, I'm going to fix the reply-to behavior for the list when I get
back. Remind me again if I forget!

On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:30:58 -0700, "M. David Peterson"

> What processor are you using to run the transform at the moment? Saxon
> or Saxon.NET?

Most of us are on Mac OS X, which means Saxon Classic.

Bruce


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Re: questions on dbng-html.xsl

Bruce D'Arcus
In reply to this post by James Howison
On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 00:01:34 -0500, "James Howison" <[hidden email]>
said:

> Yeah, did I see right that you are considering the Trac system?

Yes, David got Trac setup. Now he just needs to commit some code before
I officially move the location. I was exploring buying a domain name for
this project so we could get a stable url (right?), but someone parked
the domains for xbiblio.
 
> It seems to me that building a great set of test cases and a regression
> testing system is vital to a system like this, do you agree?  Do you
> have any ideas on how we can get something like that going?

We need to expand the test document to include more -- and more varied
-- references.

Bruce